Artificial Intelligence Computing Leadership from NVIDIA
XenDesktop 7.6 - Autocad mouse issues
Thanks for your answer. The CPU Infos confirm my thoughts and expactations, thanks for that. Perhaps this could be some addtional performance. -> Rendering is CPU related, the software takes in this case 100% with all cores, we have switched today from 4 vCPU to 8, now its agreable and okay to use and similar to local workstations. In the configuration which i have posted, we have round about 28 Users (80+ in summary) per Server, and 7 VMs per GPU. All users have 2 monitors, most of them 1920x1200. Most usecases are smooth and better than on the old fat clients which are outdated. -> Only issues are AutoCAD related, with some lagging or bad user experience while doing certain workflows. In summary this specific users usecases are a little bit a question mark for the proof of conecpt. CPU, RAM and GPU-RAM are not too busy in this cases and there is no significant usage visible, end user latency and network is also not a topic. These are very complex drawings with a high number of objects. Users are making changes, adding lines, lots of copy paste stuff, lots of zooming in and out in the workflows. Then there are some lags, sometimes mouse performance is not the best as in comparison to other files or other programs. -> Things which i have in mind to try are disabling some autocad advanced features/options, playing a little bit with the NVIDIA graphic profile/system settings (performance/quality or a individual setting instead of the default which is "Let the 3D Application decide") or installing AutoCAD 2020 instead of 2019. Do you ever have had the need of customzing/tuning AutoCAD by itself or choosing individual NVIDIA Settings?
Thanks for your answer. The CPU Infos confirm my thoughts and expactations, thanks for that. Perhaps this could be some addtional performance.

-> Rendering is CPU related, the software takes in this case 100% with all cores, we have switched today from 4 vCPU to 8, now its agreable and okay to use and similar to local workstations.

In the configuration which i have posted, we have round about 28 Users (80+ in summary) per Server, and 7 VMs per GPU.

All users have 2 monitors, most of them 1920x1200.

Most usecases are smooth and better than on the old fat clients which are outdated.

-> Only issues are AutoCAD related, with some lagging or bad user experience while doing certain workflows. In summary this specific users usecases are a little bit a question mark for the proof of conecpt.

CPU, RAM and GPU-RAM are not too busy in this cases and there is no significant usage visible, end user latency and network is also not a topic.

These are very complex drawings with a high number of objects. Users are making changes, adding lines, lots of copy paste stuff, lots of zooming in and out in the workflows. Then there are some lags, sometimes mouse performance is not the best as in comparison to other files or other programs.

-> Things which i have in mind to try are disabling some autocad advanced features/options, playing a little bit with the NVIDIA graphic profile/system settings (performance/quality or a individual setting instead of the default which is "Let the 3D Application decide") or installing AutoCAD 2020 instead of 2019.

Do you ever have had the need of customzing/tuning AutoCAD by itself or choosing individual NVIDIA Settings?

#16
Posted 03/10/2020 11:37 AM   
Hi Thanks for the details. Increasing the CPUs Clock Speed would give you more performance, especially with more complicated models, and 3.2 to 3.6GHz should give a noticeable improvement. Something else that's worth validating .... When you have time outside of business hours (or during business hours if you have an empty server with the same Specification), try running the same workload but with only 1 user connected to the Server and see if there's a performance or experience difference. The reason being that your CPUs now have a 4.5x overcommit on them, assuming all 28 users are running 8 vCPUs and there is nothing else running on the Servers, whereas previously is was closer to 2.3x. This would tell you whether you'd be better going for more Cores or increased Clock Speed. For example, with the 3.4GHz 16 Core CPUs mentioned previously, you'd get a slightly faster Clock, and reduce the overcommit to 3.5x if everything else stayed the same. It's always worth knowing at what point your hardware's performance starts to deteriorate, and if 2 or 3 people start rendering at the same time or with overlaps on the same Host, you could end up with peaky performance which is really frustrating, this is more likely to happen with increased vCPUs, so it's worth keeping an eye on, especially if drawings start to become more complex. On the platforms I design, deliver and support, I always make sure they're kept well up to date and are running the latest versions of Software and Operating Systems. vGPU drivers are always kept up to date as well. The Applications get treated a little differently, as moving to newer Applications can initially reduce productivity if there are significant differences between that and the previous version. It's easy for me to just say run the latest Applications, when I'm not the person that will actually be using them. However, the recommendation to my customers is always try and run the latest versions of whichever Applications you use to take advantage of the latest features, performance and functionality. However, the users may (and probably will) need some time to adapt before any real performance metrics can be gathered. So to directly answer your question, if the users are happy to do so, then I would be running AutoCAD 2020 over 2019. For the NVIDIA Control Panel, I typically let the users decide what they want to tweak inside there. This is always going to be Application specific as to any benefits and as AutoCAD is typically CPU limited, modifying the NVIDIA Control Panel doesn't always give much benefit in my experience. There are some basic settings inside AutoCAD that can make things run more smoothly, and there are plenty of random guides on the internet of things to try that relate to the entire Operating System. For example, have you run the Citrix or VMware Optimiser tools? If you're not locked into those server specifications and this is still a POC, I think the biggest gain you're going to see will be CPU related by going for a different model. If these are your production servers, then you're effectively trying to turn things off to improve existing performance, so system wide optimisations are key, which is why I mention the Optimisation Tools. Regards MG
Hi

Thanks for the details.

Increasing the CPUs Clock Speed would give you more performance, especially with more complicated models, and 3.2 to 3.6GHz should give a noticeable improvement.

Something else that's worth validating .... When you have time outside of business hours (or during business hours if you have an empty server with the same Specification), try running the same workload but with only 1 user connected to the Server and see if there's a performance or experience difference. The reason being that your CPUs now have a 4.5x overcommit on them, assuming all 28 users are running 8 vCPUs and there is nothing else running on the Servers, whereas previously is was closer to 2.3x. This would tell you whether you'd be better going for more Cores or increased Clock Speed. For example, with the 3.4GHz 16 Core CPUs mentioned previously, you'd get a slightly faster Clock, and reduce the overcommit to 3.5x if everything else stayed the same. It's always worth knowing at what point your hardware's performance starts to deteriorate, and if 2 or 3 people start rendering at the same time or with overlaps on the same Host, you could end up with peaky performance which is really frustrating, this is more likely to happen with increased vCPUs, so it's worth keeping an eye on, especially if drawings start to become more complex.

On the platforms I design, deliver and support, I always make sure they're kept well up to date and are running the latest versions of Software and Operating Systems. vGPU drivers are always kept up to date as well. The Applications get treated a little differently, as moving to newer Applications can initially reduce productivity if there are significant differences between that and the previous version. It's easy for me to just say run the latest Applications, when I'm not the person that will actually be using them. However, the recommendation to my customers is always try and run the latest versions of whichever Applications you use to take advantage of the latest features, performance and functionality. However, the users may (and probably will) need some time to adapt before any real performance metrics can be gathered. So to directly answer your question, if the users are happy to do so, then I would be running AutoCAD 2020 over 2019.

For the NVIDIA Control Panel, I typically let the users decide what they want to tweak inside there. This is always going to be Application specific as to any benefits and as AutoCAD is typically CPU limited, modifying the NVIDIA Control Panel doesn't always give much benefit in my experience. There are some basic settings inside AutoCAD that can make things run more smoothly, and there are plenty of random guides on the internet of things to try that relate to the entire Operating System. For example, have you run the Citrix or VMware Optimiser tools?

If you're not locked into those server specifications and this is still a POC, I think the biggest gain you're going to see will be CPU related by going for a different model. If these are your production servers, then you're effectively trying to turn things off to improve existing performance, so system wide optimisations are key, which is why I mention the Optimisation Tools.

Regards

MG

#17
Posted 03/10/2020 03:17 PM   
Basically we are caring very much about a clean and optimized image, so i would say that this is also on a good level. We are going now as result of the PoC with the 3.4GHz 16 Core CPU, and also for the productive environment there will be AutoCAD 2020 too, surely with all the latest drivers and updates. As you mentioned, first because of the "more" need of overcommitment, and also for a benefit with a litte bit more CPU clock speed. Application based optimization and handling with the NVIDIA Control panel is then a topic for the productive pilot afterwards. Thank you very much for sharing your point of view. Wish you all the best for the moment.
Basically we are caring very much about a clean and optimized image, so i would say that this is also on a good level.

We are going now as result of the PoC with the 3.4GHz 16 Core CPU, and also for the productive environment there will be AutoCAD 2020 too, surely with all the latest drivers and updates. As you mentioned, first because of the "more" need of overcommitment, and also for a benefit with a litte bit more CPU clock speed. Application based optimization and handling with the NVIDIA Control panel is then a topic for the productive pilot afterwards.

Thank you very much for sharing your point of view. Wish you all the best for the moment.

#18
Posted 03/10/2020 06:21 PM   
Hi You're welcome. I hope some of what has been discussed is useful. Please feel free to post back on here and let us know how you get on with the changes. Best of luck with the PoC Regards MG
Hi

You're welcome. I hope some of what has been discussed is useful. Please feel free to post back on here and let us know how you get on with the changes.

Best of luck with the PoC

Regards

MG

#19
Posted 03/10/2020 07:35 PM   
Scroll To Top

Add Reply