NVIDIA
Please be so kind and let me know if is possible somehow unify or merge the performance of 4 GRID K1 units under W2012R2. Scenario: W2012R2, nVidia GRID K1, in system are 4 independent graphic cards. Is any possibility how to achieve that W2012 works with this 4 cards as 1 unit? Or it isnt possible and is needed some Quadro series card, thanks a lot for reply
Please be so kind and let me know if is possible somehow unify or merge the performance of 4 GRID K1 units under W2012R2.
Scenario: W2012R2, nVidia GRID K1, in system are 4 independent graphic cards.
Is any possibility how to achieve that W2012 works with this 4 cards as 1 unit?
Or it isnt possible and is needed some Quadro series card, thanks a lot for reply

#1
Posted 07/29/2015 10:04 AM   
Can you explain what you're trying to do as that will affect the answer. What are you planning to run on the server? RDSH, Citrix XenApp, something else? BTW, it's not possible to fit 4 K1 cards into a server chassis and no OEM offers it. OR are you referring to the 4 GPU's on a single card?
Can you explain what you're trying to do as that will affect the answer.

What are you planning to run on the server? RDSH, Citrix XenApp, something else?


BTW, it's not possible to fit 4 K1 cards into a server chassis and no OEM offers it. OR are you referring to the 4 GPU's on a single card?

Jason Southern, Regional Lead for ProVis Sales - EMEA: NVIDIA Ltd.

#2
Posted 07/30/2015 07:49 AM   
Dear Jason, thanks a lot for reply, I try to make it clear: RDSH for session based remote desktop, not 4 K1 cards in one server. one GRID K1 card in one server, W2012 running on it, and in device manager is 4 graphic devices - related to four GPUs on that sigle card, connected users(remote desktop) are using only one of this four graphic cards in system. I would be happy if I could somehow unify and use performance of all 4 GPU, now only 1 of 4 is busy. I didnt find any way how to do it, and I think that only solution is use some Quadro K series card, for this application. regards MiB
Dear Jason,

thanks a lot for reply, I try to make it clear: RDSH for session based remote desktop, not 4 K1 cards in one server. one GRID K1 card in one server, W2012 running on it, and in device manager is 4 graphic devices - related to four GPUs on that sigle card, connected users(remote desktop) are using only one of this four graphic cards in system. I would be happy if I could somehow unify and use performance of all 4 GPU, now only 1 of 4 is busy. I didnt find any way how to do it, and I think that only solution is use some Quadro K series card, for this application.

regards

MiB

#3
Posted 07/30/2015 09:43 AM   
What you're seeing is the way that the OS is handling the placement of the workloads. It's a limitation in the OS that it will only place the graphics workload on what it see's as the primary GPU, so the first of the K1 GPU's. Is the GPU you're seeing load on running at 100%? You should also be aware that unless you're running RemoteFX, the remote session will not see GPU acceleration. Citrix have some experimental code for allowing round robin use of DirectX workloads across the GPU's, but that will require XenApp. If you have the option of a hypervisor that supports passthrough (XenServer, vSphere or KVM) then you could configure 4 VM's each with one GPU. Hyper-V doesn't support this though, it has an alternate solution but Microsoft doesn't support it for RDSH If these aren't an option and you can't virtualise then you're correct, you'll need a good sized Quadro card.
What you're seeing is the way that the OS is handling the placement of the workloads. It's a limitation in the OS that it will only place the graphics workload on what it see's as the primary GPU, so the first of the K1 GPU's.

Is the GPU you're seeing load on running at 100%?

You should also be aware that unless you're running RemoteFX, the remote session will not see GPU acceleration.

Citrix have some experimental code for allowing round robin use of DirectX workloads across the GPU's, but that will require XenApp.

If you have the option of a hypervisor that supports passthrough (XenServer, vSphere or KVM) then you could configure 4 VM's each with one GPU. Hyper-V doesn't support this though, it has an alternate solution but Microsoft doesn't support it for RDSH

If these aren't an option and you can't virtualise then you're correct, you'll need a good sized Quadro card.

Jason Southern, Regional Lead for ProVis Sales - EMEA: NVIDIA Ltd.

#4
Posted 07/31/2015 08:08 AM   
I am also interested in combining the power of two grid enabled card. It could be K or M series, it does not matter because i am currently considering to buy a server with 2 cards on it but i have some doubt that it won't deliver enough rendering power for my application and needs. Basically, i am working on large files to create scientific visualisations and performing in-situ visualisation using Paraview, Catalyst and i had a Quadro K5200 installed on Dell T620 server and at least i am expecting to get same level of power from the Grid enabled cards with remote visualisation support but according to their specs, it is hard to get enough performance from single card. Anyway, could you widen me with your experience. Do you have any suggestion about it. Regards, --ufuk
I am also interested in combining the power of two grid enabled card. It could be K or M series, it does not matter because i am currently considering to buy a server with 2 cards on it but i have some doubt that it won't deliver enough rendering power for my application and needs. Basically, i am working on large files to create scientific visualisations and performing in-situ visualisation using Paraview, Catalyst and i had a Quadro K5200 installed on Dell T620 server and at least i am expecting to get same level of power from the Grid enabled cards with remote visualisation support but according to their specs, it is hard to get enough performance from single card. Anyway, could you widen me with your experience. Do you have any suggestion about it.

Regards,

--ufuk

#5
Posted 08/05/2016 06:56 AM   
Hi An M60 should be very similar in performance to the K5200 when you look at the specs, although it lacks a few CUDA cores and some memory bandwidth by comparison, but the newer architecture and increased Clock speeds might make up for it. However, it will do that for 2 sessions, whereas the K5200 will only support 1 session. Currently, I'm not aware of any Operating System that can use both GPUs on the M60 at the same time to access the full 16GB, I'm happy to be proven wrong though and I'm sure there are some clever people working on this out there somewhere... :-) For what it's worth, I don't think it's really a fair comparison, as the M60 is designed for multiple sessions, the K5200 is single session (unless you add it to an RDS / XenApp server...). Rather than try and use this model GPU in a way in which it was not intended, you might be better off looking at an M5000 / M6000 or wait a bit longer now that the Pascal GPUs have been announced and look at a P5000 / P6000 (I believe these will start to become available early October) which are the successors to the K5200 you mention. You can add the Quadro cards to a VM in exactly the same way as the Tesla (M60), but as mentioned, they are a 1-1 mapping, but you can still access them remotely if you wish. Regards Ben
Hi

An M60 should be very similar in performance to the K5200 when you look at the specs, although it lacks a few CUDA cores and some memory bandwidth by comparison, but the newer architecture and increased Clock speeds might make up for it. However, it will do that for 2 sessions, whereas the K5200 will only support 1 session. Currently, I'm not aware of any Operating System that can use both GPUs on the M60 at the same time to access the full 16GB, I'm happy to be proven wrong though and I'm sure there are some clever people working on this out there somewhere... :-)

For what it's worth, I don't think it's really a fair comparison, as the M60 is designed for multiple sessions, the K5200 is single session (unless you add it to an RDS / XenApp server...). Rather than try and use this model GPU in a way in which it was not intended, you might be better off looking at an M5000 / M6000 or wait a bit longer now that the Pascal GPUs have been announced and look at a P5000 / P6000 (I believe these will start to become available early October) which are the successors to the K5200 you mention. You can add the Quadro cards to a VM in exactly the same way as the Tesla (M60), but as mentioned, they are a 1-1 mapping, but you can still access them remotely if you wish.

Regards

Ben

#6
Posted 08/07/2016 11:03 AM   
Thanks Ben. It is always good to get information from experienced users like you. I know that it is not fair to compare different products that have different purposes but based on your comments, at least, i could expect very close performance from M60. That is nice. I know that P series are not available yet and there might be a possibility to see Pascal processor also in Nvidia Grid platform but i think we have still time for it. That is really nice to hear that K5200 can be also used in VM even if it supports only single session. In this case, the data is rendered in remote system like Grid. Right? So, i could get advantage of GPU using remote session. By the way, are you aware any web page or blog that explains the setup of scum kind of system step by step. I know that the combination of TurboVNC and some other tools could give access to GPU in remote session. For commercial products such as Xen, do i need to use XenApp server only or VMVare Horizon etc. can be also used. Anyway, thanks for your suggestions and comments about it. Regards, --ufuk
Thanks Ben. It is always good to get information from experienced users like you. I know that it is not fair to compare different products that have different purposes but based on your comments, at least, i could expect very close performance from M60. That is nice. I know that P series are not available yet and there might be a possibility to see Pascal processor also in Nvidia Grid platform but i think we have still time for it. That is really nice to hear that K5200 can be also used in VM even if it supports only single session. In this case, the data is rendered in remote system like Grid. Right? So, i could get advantage of GPU using remote session. By the way, are you aware any web page or blog that explains the setup of scum kind of system step by step. I know that the combination of TurboVNC and some other tools could give access to GPU in remote session. For commercial products such as Xen, do i need to use XenApp server only or VMVare Horizon etc. can be also used. Anyway, thanks for your suggestions and comments about it.

Regards,

--ufuk

#7
Posted 08/08/2016 04:30 PM   
No problem at all, I hope my comments are useful, and if nothing else provide a few other options for you to investigate. If it were my money, and based on the specific single user scenario you've mentioned, I'd wait till the Pascal Quadro cards are available in a couple of months before upgrading, if this is something you decide to do. Such is the progress with the technology, they will be much more powerful than the K5200. If I wanted to support more than a single user on [i]dedicated[/i] VMs, then it has to be an M60 for best performance and capacity. The M60 also has a "Compute" or "Graphics" mode, and can be switched between the 2 depending on workload for flexibility, with that plus the support for multiple users and differing profiles it makes it a much more flexible card than a Quadro, but as said, they have different use cases. Regarding adding the K5200 into a VM for remote access, this will work, but you may find your resolution is limited as the cards are designed to output through the local Display Connectors (DVI + DP), unlike the Tesla GPUs which don't have any local Display Connectors as they are designed to be used within a server. As a work around, you may be able to use a special "Headless GPU Dongle" that connects to the local Display Connectors, this makes the GPU output at full resolution when accessed remotely. If you purchase a Server for the GPU, make sure your card is on the HCL. Also, you may need a "GPU enablement kit" from that vendor (typically power cables and low profile heat-syncs) and finally you may need upgraded PSUs to support the GPU. Check with the vendor first, or it can get expensive if you have to buy bits afterwards... Just as a heads up, your GPU desktop, doesn't need to be a VM, it can be a physical PC / Server with a client / agent installed that you access remotely, removing the hypervisor and keeping the performance level. If you use a PC / Workstation for this, then it may be easier to get around any Server HCLs. Obviously using a physical workstation vs virtual workstation has pros and cons too. There are plenty of remote access solutions out there, with Citrix and VMware being the most common at the moment. I don't really want to get drawn into which is best, as they both have their pros and cons. Hypervisor wise, you're looking at Citrix XenServer, VMware ESXi or KVM. There's no one guide that will cover every step, as it depends how you want to build the solution. But with all the differing technologies available at the moment, you are spoilt for choice as to what to do. There really are many many different options. However, if you are looking for some information from NVIDIA, here's a good place to start: [url]http://www.nvidia.com/object/grid-enterprise-resources.html#guides[/url] Regards Ben
No problem at all, I hope my comments are useful, and if nothing else provide a few other options for you to investigate.

If it were my money, and based on the specific single user scenario you've mentioned, I'd wait till the Pascal Quadro cards are available in a couple of months before upgrading, if this is something you decide to do. Such is the progress with the technology, they will be much more powerful than the K5200. If I wanted to support more than a single user on dedicated VMs, then it has to be an M60 for best performance and capacity. The M60 also has a "Compute" or "Graphics" mode, and can be switched between the 2 depending on workload for flexibility, with that plus the support for multiple users and differing profiles it makes it a much more flexible card than a Quadro, but as said, they have different use cases.

Regarding adding the K5200 into a VM for remote access, this will work, but you may find your resolution is limited as the cards are designed to output through the local Display Connectors (DVI + DP), unlike the Tesla GPUs which don't have any local Display Connectors as they are designed to be used within a server. As a work around, you may be able to use a special "Headless GPU Dongle" that connects to the local Display Connectors, this makes the GPU output at full resolution when accessed remotely. If you purchase a Server for the GPU, make sure your card is on the HCL. Also, you may need a "GPU enablement kit" from that vendor (typically power cables and low profile heat-syncs) and finally you may need upgraded PSUs to support the GPU. Check with the vendor first, or it can get expensive if you have to buy bits afterwards...

Just as a heads up, your GPU desktop, doesn't need to be a VM, it can be a physical PC / Server with a client / agent installed that you access remotely, removing the hypervisor and keeping the performance level. If you use a PC / Workstation for this, then it may be easier to get around any Server HCLs. Obviously using a physical workstation vs virtual workstation has pros and cons too.

There are plenty of remote access solutions out there, with Citrix and VMware being the most common at the moment. I don't really want to get drawn into which is best, as they both have their pros and cons. Hypervisor wise, you're looking at Citrix XenServer, VMware ESXi or KVM.

There's no one guide that will cover every step, as it depends how you want to build the solution. But with all the differing technologies available at the moment, you are spoilt for choice as to what to do. There really are many many different options. However, if you are looking for some information from NVIDIA, here's a good place to start: http://www.nvidia.com/object/grid-enterprise-resources.html#guides

Regards

Ben

#8
Posted 08/08/2016 09:58 PM   
I have a Dell T620 server with K5200 card on it. It was hard to run it without GPU enablement kit and K5200 was not supported (or not tested configuration) by Dell but i got extra power for GPU using an converter from PCI 1x to 3x along with extra power output on it. The card uses two PIC slot but at least it works without any problem. So, i could start to try single user scenario. Anyway, thanks for your help. It was really useful. Regards, --ufuk
I have a Dell T620 server with K5200 card on it. It was hard to run it without GPU enablement kit and K5200 was not supported (or not tested configuration) by Dell but i got extra power for GPU using an converter from PCI 1x to 3x along with extra power output on it. The card uses two PIC slot but at least it works without any problem. So, i could start to try single user scenario. Anyway, thanks for your help. It was really useful.

Regards,

--ufuk

#9
Posted 08/09/2016 06:19 AM   
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